Chewing the Fat: Week 15 - Broncos vs Patriots

The IAOFM staff discuss the Denver Broncos' 41-23 Week 15 loss to the New England Patriots

Ted: Happy Weird Football Sunday, gents

Doug: Hey, the band's back together! Good to see you Doc

Ted: Howdy Em

Doc: Hey, Ted, Doug. Great to be back! And, Weird is right!

Ted: The Packers insisted on attacking KC's strength all day, rather than hitting their weakness.  They might have gotten away with it, if not for bad drops and penalties. Plus, the Packers defense was bad all day. Except for the red zone

Doug: Maybe they just believe in Kyle Orton

Ted: Could be.  I'd damn sure believe in him more than Tyler Palko

Doc: Not a tough choice

Ted: He had a pretty good day between the 20s.  It was classic Orton with good protection. Which is the head-scratcher... where was the pressure?

Doug: So, we going no huddle off the bat, or what?

Ted: I doubt that. They should be ready to though. Interesting look there with Royal as HB

Doc: Should have made the toss. I'd love to see him throw to the outlet guy - Johnson was wide open

Ted: Wow, they really sealed that edge. Virgil Green!

Doc: Green's blocking has really stood out

Ted: Yeah, he's a keeper

Doc: Good to see Tim hit Ball - throw to those open outlet guys!

Ted: That was an awesome cut by Johnson in the backfield

Doc: Speaking of keepers...he's showing some signs of real skill

Ted: Yeah I like him too

Tebow breaks several tackles on his way to a 9-yard touchdown. The point after fails due to a poor snap from Lonie Paxton; 6-0 Broncos

Doug: Wow what a run!

Ted: Me like opening drive TDs. Great job Broncos. Especially the O line

Doug: WOW how did Prater catch that guy from behind?

Ted: Wow, that was ugly. Em didn't you say something about Paxton this week? You're as good a jinxer as Doug and I are

Doc: LOL - that was my fault. That's his second missed snap in 10 years

Ted: That's a good start. Nice play Marcus Thomas. But you have to tackle Hernandez. He's so good running with the ball. Great pursuit by both Thomas and Bunkley there

Doc: Wow - ugly play. Great open field tackle by Harris, good pursuit but Hernandez and Gronk may hurt us today

New England answers right back with a TD of their own on a 33-yard pass from Tom Brady to Chad Johnson

Ted: That was a bad breakdown. I need to see that

Doug: Wow, Brady is pumped. Oh wow, Goody. Was he expecting help?

Ted: Yeah, that's not the way to play man with no help. It looked like Carter was doubling inside

Doug: That's a strange looking gamble. But Goody's not a gambler right?

Doc: Not usually, no

Ted: Not typically.  I think that was a miscommunication. Somebody will ask Fox, I'm sure

Doc: Carter miss the call?

Ted: Or, Goody thought he had help - to squat like that, you have to think you have help

Doug: Had to be, that was Deltha O'Neal-like

Ted: The dirty secret is that Ochocinco is more dangerous than Branch

Doc: Absolutely

Ted: Branch is steady, which is why he plays. He does well with the sight adjustment stuff. McGahee isn't getting tackled by a WR

Doug: That was a really nice throw - maybe the best I've seen from Tebow all year

Ted: That was a really decisive throw there. I like the route by DT too

Doc: Bey Bey is so strong

Doug: Wow this defense is even worse than i'd expected. Holy smokes!

Lance Ball runs 32 yards for another Denver touchdown; 13-7 Broncos

Ted: They're terrible. The Redskins ran all day on them last week. If Santana Moss didn't go all Marion Barber, the Skins might have won. Moore had that dead to rights. Catch the ball, kid

Doug: Something he's supposed to be good at

Ted: Harris had good coverage there to me. Okay, that was a hold. He had awesome coverage to go with it, at least

Doug: Harris' first penalty of the year

Doc: Good young guy

Ted: Great read by Harris there on the run. I think we have to be pretty happy all around with the start of this game

Doc: Sure am, Ted

Doug: No doubt. Save a takeaway, couldn't have gone better

Doc: Two scoring drives and a quick out for NE isn't something I really expected. Great to see, though

Ted: The Patriots are clearly more talented, so having a puncher's chance is a good start

Doc: One more score wouldn't hurt, but I'm getting greedy.

Ted: I've seen no evidence that NE can stop the Broncos yet. And it continues. Decker was well covered. MAN Lance Ball is running. Beadles did a great job there

Doc: Tebow threw 50 passes in practice before the game. He's stepping into his throws, and it's coming off his hand better, coming in with authority. Great to see. Ball is outrageous - who turned on his switch?

Ted: Bad read there by Tebow...wide open guy on the sideline. That was awesome blocking. I've never seen a Belichick front as soft as what I've seen against Washington and in this game

Doc: I begin to wonder if BB hasn't just lost too many of his key personnel - FO as well as players - to other teams

Ted: Sucks for Carter that they're calling the cart.  He's their best rusher, and he's Rubin Carter's kid.  I consider him Broncos family.

2nd Quarter

Ted: 94 did a great job there, late flag there

Matt Prater kicks a 26-yard FG on 4th and 1 to put the Broncos up 16-7

Doug: UGH go for it!! WTF?!?!

Ted: Yeah, this is time to go, definitely. I hate this call, and another craptastic snap

Doc: Strange to see two in a day, but Prater is money

Ted: Yeah, Colquitt did a great job there. It's good to keep him busy, given the lack of punts thus far. Raiders just took a 14-7 lead vs. Detroit. Short... coming back to the 1

Doc: Harris got beat

Ted: Great defense there...Mays down low

Doc: Ayers and WW came in to keep him from falling forward

After a TD by Wes Welker was overturned, Aaron Hernandez scores on a 1-yard pass from Brady; 16-14 Broncos. On the next play from scrimmage, Lance Ball fumbles and the ball is recovered by New England at Denver’s 19-yard line

Ted: OMG that was not needed

Doug: Wow one hand lance? Damn

Doc: Yeah, terrible ball control

Ted: Classic Brady there with that sneak

Doug: Still don't know why we don't have Tebow do that

Ted: They definitely should

Doc: Sure should. It would help the interior line a lot, I always loved 4th and 1, knowing that Elway would sneak it

Ted: Big play here... it'd be great to hold to a FG.

New England settles for a 21-yard FG to take a 17-16 lead; three plays later, Tebow is stripped of the ball by Mark Anderson, who recovers at the Denver 40

Ted: Great timing can tell they're working on that

Doc: Gonna say the same - Bey Bey and Tim seem to be developing a connection

Doug: Yikes WTF?!

Ted: I didn't think Royal was winning that fight for the ball

TJ: The one downside to this offense is the high-risk/high-reward ball handling if you run it long term

Ted: This is how you lose a game where your running game is unstoppable, in case anybody was wondering

Doc: Nice stop by Doom and DJ

Doug: Wow place is shaking, nice!

New England goes for it on 4th and 1, with Brady connecting with Hernandez for a 25-yard gain

Doc: Oh, heck

Ted: Woodyard was nowhere near his man

TJ: That is probably why BB is a HOF coach, while Fox is just another guy. I mean with all due respect to Fox and the narrative of him "changing, etc."

Ted: Well, Fox isn't responsible for the two fumbles

TJ: I don't think I was talking about fumbles, Ted. I was talking about the call.

Ted: I thought you were talking in general. Yeah, BB does have the balls to go on 4th a lot

TJ: BB is also giving Fox a little lesson on clock management right now

Brady sneaks it in for a 1-yard score; 24-16 Patriots

Doug: Wow, Brady. That was an emphatic spike

TJ: He's a little fired up

Ted: Well, the Broncos have all 3 TOs, so it's time to try to get down the field

Doug: Yeah no messing around here

TJ: When you have an offense like this, whether it's option or a zone read, the ball handling skills required are high

Doc: Good point, TJ

TJ: It's a bit of a high risk/high reward sort of deal. Not super high risk, but riskier than, say, a pro-style offense would be. Tebow can do that, but can Lance Ball and Eddie Royal?

Ted: Wow, number 10 has a hell of a high-top fade there. Wow, bad time to lose the strike zone

Doug: I was going to say I've only seen two bad throws from Tebow, but that's three now

TJ: Is Fox trying to give it back before half? Great clock management, Fox

Doug: Wow, BB > JF. Again

TJ: Again, one guy is a HOF coach, the other is just a guy

Ted: Well we need a great punt here

Doug: Especially in terms of aggression and clock management...

Ted: Wow, that missed tackle hurt

TJ: If they get a FG, Fox should get a lot of heat

Ted: Dumervil got held. I'm not too wild about the defensive scheme today

TJ: Nate Solder is flat owning Von. Nate Solder from CU, I should add.

Quan Cosby muffs a punt return, and the Pats recover at the Denver 16. Gostkowski tacks on a 34-yarder to give the Pats a 27-16 lead at the half


TJ: Oh my God, the Coz

Ted: Unbelievable

Doug: WTF is going on here?!

Ted: This game has gone beyond sideways in the second quarter

TJ: I actually consider that karma for John Fox's stupid clock management

Ted: It might be... I couldn't agree more that it was dumb

TJ: This game should be in the locker room right now. That's on you, Fox

Doug: Yeah couldn't agree more, that's all on Fox. Then again, Tebow hits one of those two throws and maybe it's not a problem.

Ted: Well, let's remember, the Patriots have shown no ability to stop the Broncos running game when they don't fumble.  they can get this thing refocused, and get back on track

Doc: Good point. Sans mistakes, Denver has been able to move the ball well. It's just keeping up that's tough

Doug: That doesn't take away from the gaffes

TJ: Sure, Quan was bad there

Ted: It sure would be nice if the Lions got going. 17-14 Raiders in the 3rd

Ted: A whole half of football with 30 dropbacks, and neither QB has been hit once. I feel like the Broncos are afraid to send a fifth rusher, but it's time to start running Miller up the A gap here and there

3rd Quarter

Ted: There's a hit on's a start. Good call to play coverage there

Doug: Safety?! Holding?! UGH

Ted: Oh my God, brutal, brutal play by Ayers

Doug: I guess he didn't know the situation. I mean, they’re not even trying to convert. It’s a giveaway down

Ted: Ridiculous. Who cares if you even get pressure on 3rd and 24?

Doug: WOW, that was some kind of run, damn. Ugh Q

Ted: I have a glasstop desk, and it's a miracle I didn't just break it

Doug: Some really $@#%ty tackling

Ted: Brady loved Welker on Harris.  Harris was too far off and inside. Nice rush by Q

Doug: Wow Q that's redemption, via DA!

Doc: Heck of a play

Ted: There are 6 guys in 3 position groupings who can really make a big leap next season with a good offseason, and boost the Broncos out of rebuilding fever:  DT, Decker, Beadles, Walton, Carter and Moore, not to mention Tebow

Doc: I'd add Franklin, but I agree. Marcus Thomas, too, although he's already playing well

Ted: Franklin could get a lot better with his feet

Doc: I agree. He's never played RT before, and they seem fixed on keeping him there. I'm as worried about the interior of the line on short yardage, but the Tebow sneaks may help with that

Ted: I think Beadles and Walton can really advance with a full offseason's NFL strength program. Great checkoff and throw

Doc: I hope so. I'm a bit worried about the balance issue with Beadles - stiff at the knees, bends at the waist and loses his balance that way. He's got a lot of potential, though

Ted: I'd have liked to see Tebow truck that guy

Doc: Here's a good chance to see how they handle 3rd and short

Ted: That was risky by Ball to stick that football out

Doc: That scared me. The spot was good - the whistle very slow

Ted: Good throwaway there. That was the circumstance where Tillman got him last week. That was really, really bad. Come on, Tim. No separation, but go forward

Doc: Yes, that one's on TT. Clady did a decent job of giving him time.

TJ: I think I saw Orton do that earlier today, but never expected it from Tim, haha.

Ted: Nice job Willis

Doug: Damn, Pats really lucked out to hold onto that ball

TJ: Jesus, Colquitt acts like he just hit a home run in the bottom of the 9th. They are all getting a little too Nate Webster right now, DJ the worst. Dang, moore got used. DJ continues to play on his back

Ted: Like he's waiting for a dyme to meet him there

TJ: Wow Ocho blocks?

Doug: Uh oh facemask. Oh, McBean loves him those facemasks

Ted: McBean tried to get out of there quick, but he got caught

Doug: Yeah he did, that was bad luck

TJ: Got his money's worth

Ted: Well, this is what it looks like when 1-53 and the coaching staff put together a mistake-filled game

Danny Woodhead runs it in from 10 yards out; 34-16 Patriots

TJ: DJ got pwned

Ted: DJ needs to take on that block

Doug: Wow Champ yelling at him?

TJ: Yeah, he played Toro. Ted, you are right

Ted: Still 17-14 Oakland

Doug: Yeah they're in Janikowski’s range though

Ted: I'm putting it on one of my monitors

Doug: WTF? Man, Cosby has been so good this year. A few dumb decisions, but he's been rock solid. Yet today? Yikes

TJ: Not a good day for Quan. He is taking it in the gut today.

Ted: That's the story of the game... mistake after mistake for the whole team

TJ: Remember, fumbles are random - at least collecting them

Ted: Fumbling isn't

TJ: During this streak Denver has been picking them off and not losing them

Ted: They need to hold on to the ball

TJ: Today, it just appears to have gone the opposite way, so what appears to be "good" or "mistake free" one game is just randomness showing her face. We are always looking for a narrative to explain stuff. Hell, they could have just as easily picked up all 3 fumbles today. Man, I hate when the pundits find a nut, and it becomes reality. Dumbasses

Doc: Lots of penalties spread around - McBean probably belongs on the list of guys who are stepping up, despite the face mask penalty. Cosby screwing up, other fumbles, Miller's 2 penalties. They're showing their youth.

Ted: I'm cool with it happening in a bunch, all in one game. I tried to get my girlfriend to read Fooled by Randomness, TJ, and I don't think she's gotten very far

Doc: To me it's just what you brought out earlier, Ted - that list of players who will benefit from a full offseason's training. This is such a young team, and we're seeing the young team mistakes.

Ted: Well, I still believe that we have rebuilding fever, and I've been trying to stay grounded to that. But it's hard sometimes

Doc: Sure is. Especially when you realize that Denver would be firmly in this game without even SOME of the mistakes.

4th Quarter

Tebow fumbles in the end zone, avoids a safety, and throws the ball away

TJ: That may not have been the smartest play I've ever seen

Ted: That was equal parts awful and awesome

TJ: Ouch, he got trucked

Ted: Detroit just lost a fumble for a TD

TJ: I'm still not quite sure why you would put your QB of the future in so many of these situations where he gets to take shot after shot. He may be able to withstand it over 5 or 6 years, but to what end? It still makes me question their commitment.

Ted: I think Carolina is doing the same with Newton. That's an underplayed story, but a lot of what's being done with Tebow is being done there too

Doc: That's right. Lots of the same plays and approaches

TJ: To what end, though, for the "right now"?

Doc: They believe that he can take it, TJ. I just hope they're right

TJ: It's shot after shot after shot. That was a shot! by Doom! But strip it, dude

Ted: That was worse than any hit Tebow's taken

TJ: Is it a competition, Ted?

Ted: No, but I believe that the worst hits Tebow takes are in the pocket

TJ: I don't agree with that.

Doug: How about the one he just took on 3rd down?

TJ: I just saw him take a big hit to the head on a designed run

Ted: Yeah, he took a bad one there, but that's been the exception to me

TJ: I don't get why you would purposely do that to your 1st-round QB of the future under the guise of "right now, guys"

Doc: Still don't see them committing to TT, TJ?

TJ: It just makes me wonder if that's a commitment or simply a commitment to a small streak. I'm saying it boggles my mind why they are okay with their QB of the future taking 20-30 hits a game.  Double and triple takes from me

Doc: Because it won 7 of 8?

Ted: Detroit's in the scoring area

TJ: Ted said he's the strongest human being to ever play quarterback. Even so, I don't get why you would purposely make the strongest man to ever play the position take 30 shots a game like a RB.

Ted: I've said that and so has Jon Gruden.  He had a reported 38 reps at 225 in college, and didn't do it at the combine, because his agent didn't want that to be the story

TJ: Just because he can take them means you design for it? Great throw!

Ted: Great play there by Tebow to set that up. He drew that defender to the run. It was Elway-like for a second

Doc: Beautifully done, and a great run after catch

TJ: Doc, do you disagree with that? It's like saying, “Well I have GI Joe, so let's go ahead and let him take as many grenades as possible.” Since he's the strongest human to play the position.

Ted: I don't agree with that approach either, TJ.  I think you have to be careful with it

TJ: So, Ted, there's never been a QB with more reps at the combine?

Ted: No

TJ: I didn't know that.

Ted: Not even close. 25 was the record, by Cutler and a few others. Sexton didn't want Tebow talked about as weird because of it

TJ: Like that shot there. I just cringe - he just took a huge shot to the back, and that's how they treat the QB of the next 5 years? Or 7? Or 10? Why would you do that?

Doc: Here's my feeling, TJ. This is the offesnse that he's run effectively. He won a lot of games with it this year. Will he be able to keep it up as long as another style? No. But the theory is that every running QB has to learn to throw better. When Tim does, he won't have to take those hits

Tebow runs it in from two yards out; 34-23 Patriots

TJ: Great , Fox, you just scored. You've got a great "right now. And your QB of the future just took a massive throttle to the back. So you're asking me if they might have a commitment problem, Doc?

Doc: TJ, the point is to develop TT's game so that this changes. It's a tool, and they'll use it as the Eagles did with McNabb, but the idea is to both win now and to develop the more complete system.

TJ: I'd say I have a problem with it, yeah.  Further, I disagree with the approach.

Doc: They want that to last a long time. It's not an unreasonable theory, although I understand your feelings

TJ: Well anyway, who cares, it's just talking.

Ted: This is a growth opportunity for a young team

Doug: Hey, the game's far from over

Ted: Agreed. I am talking about the situation being something they can learn from

TJ: You're on fire, DJ!

Ted: He's been bad today. Hernandez can make any LB look bad, but still. Thomas got held late

Doug: Nice! That's a huge one. Huge

Ted: Yuge, as Francesa would say

Doug: Hold them to a FG here and there's still a chance. TD and it's over

Ted: Moore has tackled really poorly since he was unburied

Doc: Moore's tackling is one of the reasons they sat him. Talk about needing an offseason's conditioning...

Ted: Lions have ball on own 2, with 2:14 and no TOs

Doug: Pats probably happy to run clock here. Still, stuff them here and you never know

Ted: I would be too Doug. I love that.... BP ran a tourism ad for the Gulf of Mexico. How great is that?

Doug: Did they really? Hahaha

Ted: A commercial and a placement... lovely

Doug: Um, will BP pay everyone's cancer bills later on?

Ted: Bunkley hurt

TJ: Not good there

Doug: Well, he's moving. His arms are moving, whew. That's probably a TD

TJ: Wow I would challenge that if I was NE, or just burn more clock

Doug: There's probably not video proof

Ted: Bunkley's OK, good

BenJarvus Green-Ellis scores from a yard out; 41-23 Patriots

Doug: Oh, well

Ted: I'll give it to the Patriots, they've capitalized on every mistake. This isn't a championship roster, but they play championship football a lot of the time. Lions ball inside the 20. CJ big catch downfield

TJ: Tebow looks gimpy to me right now.

Ted: I hope not.  I'd hate to go see Brady Quinn play in Buffalo

Tebow takes a 28-yard sack on 4th and 17

TJ: Oh my

Ted: 4th down, what are you going to do?

TJ: How about throw it?

Doc: Guys, I think that does it for me. It's been a lot of fun to hang out with you all again

Doug: Yeah, great to have you back Doc

Chewing the Fat